       TRAVELLER Digest 49

Topics covered in this issue include:

  1) Mail address of the List by David Mark Johnson <djohnson@newtokyo.demon.co.uk>
  2) *Shall Not Perish* TML Regency Sourcebook by David Johnson <david@gwis2.circ.gwu.edu>
  3) World Tamers Handbook is out! by ccjoe@showme.missouri.edu (Joseph Heck)
  4) Re: TRAVELLER digest 48 by MOBTOTRM@vaxc.cc.monash.edu.au
  5) MORE REAL STUFF by john.bogan@asb.com
  6) GDW Doom and Gloom: by Jo_Grant.LOTUSINT@PLATO.lotus.com
  7) mixed by Joni M Virolainen <jonimv@evitech.fi>
  8) TRAVELLER digest 46 by Hugh Foster <100326.446@compuserve.com>
  9) TRAVELLER digest 47 by Hugh Foster <100326.446@compuserve.com>
 10) TRAVELLER digest 45 by Hugh Foster <100326.446@compuserve.com>
 11) REAL high-tech societies. by CHiggin@aol.com
 12) GDW's games by CHiggin@aol.com

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Thu, 22 Sep 1994 21:41:35 +0200 (BST)
From: David Mark Johnson <djohnson@newtokyo.demon.co.uk>
To: traveller@MPGN.COM
Subject: Mail address of the List
Message-ID: <m0qnuxT-0005BTC@newtokyo.demon.co.uk>

Could some one send me the addresses required to subscribe to this list

Dave

-- 

/****************************************************************************\
|* David Mark Johnson    *  djohnson@cix.compulink.co.uk
*|
|*                       *  djohnson@newtokyo.demon.co.uk
*|

\****************************************************************************/

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 22 Sep 1994 17:35:21 -0400 (EDT)
From: David Johnson <david@gwis2.circ.gwu.edu>
To: traveller@MPGN.COM
Cc: david@gwis2.circ.gwu.edu (David Johnson)
Subject: *Shall Not Perish* TML Regency Sourcebook
Message-ID: <199409222135.RAA08736@gwis2.circ.gwu.edu>

Gentlesophonts:

I'm glad to see continued interest in the TML Regency sourcebook
*Shall Not Perish* on the resurrected TML.  I apologize for not
having much time to devote to it now.  Here's a brief outline
of what we've accomplished so far.  You can get the entire text
from the old TML archives at sunbane.

> *SHALL NOT PERISH* - A TML Regency Sourcebook
> 
> (Reference TML Msg 586/7338 22-Apr-1994 & Msg 602/7550 12-May-1994)
[among others]
> 
> INDEX
> Part I:
>   Regency Timeline
>   Subsector Maps and UWP Data
>   Major Worlds of the Regency
>   Regency Language
>   Regency Megacorps
> Part II:
>   Regency Government
>   Regency Politics
> Part III:
>   The Quarantine Line
>   Quarantine Service
>   Quarantine Area of Operations
> Part IV:
>   Regency Navy and Army

BTW, keep in mind that much of this is fixin' to be superseded
by GDW.  And for those of you who have contributed to *Shall
Not Perish* you might give some thought to protecting your ideas.
GDW is already considering "expropriating" our title.

Happy Travelling,

David Johnson
*Shall Not Perish* de facto Project Coordinator, inactive
Wheaton, Maryland, USA
<david@gwis2.circ.gwu.edu>

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 22 Sep 1994 17:20:44 -0500 (CDT)
From: ccjoe@showme.missouri.edu (Joseph Heck)
To: traveller@MPGN.COM (TML Submissions),
Subject: World Tamers Handbook is out!
Message-ID: <9409222220.AA45096@showme.missouri.edu>

Well, it looks like someone's favor shined down on my today, because not
only did I find out the WTH is out, but the store that is usually two
weeks behind the NET reviews managed to get it to me today!

So... here's the scoop:

Seems to have a pretty decent organization, full index in back, and preview
in the front pages. The sections of the book include:

Survey:
 the pieces and parts of a survey and what's needed to accomplish it. Some
details on what sensors do what (not much more than was already chatted 
about on TML) and difficulties and such for tasks in surveying. 

Colonial Economics:
 A full economic model on colonies and working from a Pocket point of view.
It looks real sharp on a skim, but I'm not a real good judge. Quite a bit
of detail: agriculture, industrial production, materials, power, armed 
forces, maint...
 This segment also includes a section on playing colonies on a month by
month scale of time.

Mass Combat:
 I really skimmed this, but I'd be willing to bet that it's going to be 
somewhat of a preview for Striker II...

Two Adventures:
 Bootstrap and Colony

Stars & Planets
 Ah, the pieces I was really waiting for. They kept on some info from DGP's
World Builder's - stuff on atmospheric composition, temperature and effects,
density and gravity. Looks like some good detail and tables.

Design Sequence:
 Black Powder Weapons, Wagons, Bow Weapon design, black powder cannon design.

Equipment:
 Various small blackpowder weapons, and Three new starships: Tukera Freighter
(3000 tons), Hercules-class Bulk Carrier (5000 tons), and a Frontier
Transport
(2000 tons).

I'm sure other's will have more details shortly!
-- 
 joe                          (314) 882-5000
 ccjoe@showme.missouri.edu    University of Missouri - Columbia  
 "with a little practice, writing can be an intimidating and
 impenetrable fog!" -- Calvin
 <A HREF="http://www.missouri.edu/~ccjoe">ccjoe</A>

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 23 Sep 1994 10:51:26 +1000
From: MOBTOTRM@vaxc.cc.monash.edu.au
To: traveller@MPGN.COM
Subject: Re: TRAVELLER digest 48
Message-ID: <01HHG68GZCVU9N4SR2@vaxc.cc.monash.edu.au>

G'day all,

I know very little about Traveller: The New Era, except what I am able to
glean from posts here (alvin plummera's RICE Paper #AWP-00039: Trin
in yesterday's Digest being a good example).  Would someone like to write
a short synopsis of what has happened in the intervening 70(?) since
the Rebellion, what this Virus is, what has happened to the main protagonists
in the Rebellion, etc.  I know I could buy the books in the games shop, but
they are quite expensive (and shrink-wrapped, so no peeking!).  A couple of
paragraphs would be fine, and greatly appreciated.

Cheers

MOB

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 22 Sep 94 22:41:31 
From: john.bogan@asb.com
To: traveller@MPGN.COM
Subject: MORE REAL STUFF
Message-ID: <9409222241.A5614wk@asb.com>



Favorite recreational activities aboard ship:

REAL MEN play poker

REAL ROLE PLAYERS play the room, milking the crew and 
      passengers for information.

LOONIES play the low lottery, and bet against themselves.
     (or)
LOONIES go airlock skinny-dipping (in jumpspace)

MUNCHKINS play with the ship's laser turrets



;-)

John Bogan

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 23 Sep 94 04:30:44 EDT
From: Jo_Grant.LOTUSINT@PLATO.lotus.com
To: UNIXML::"traveller @ MPGN.COM"@lotus.com
Subject: GDW Doom and Gloom:
Message-ID: <9409230830.AA05858@Mail.Lotus.com>

~~inner_header~~
To: UNIXML::"traveller @ MPGN.COM"
Subject: GDW Doom and Gloom:

David Reed blathers on for some time and then says:
>Has anyone else noticed that all of GDW's current run of role-
>playing games is centered around societal recovery after a
>holocaust?
 You forgot "Space: 1889". This is  quite the
opposite; it is a soceity making great strides through
an age of enlightenment!
   Jo

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 23 Sep 1994 11:29:33 +0200 (EET)
From: Joni M Virolainen <jonimv@evitech.fi>
To: traveller@MPGN.COM
Subject: mixed
Message-ID: <199409230826.EAA09583@Mithril.MPGN.COM>

First Nation
------------
I totally agree with Jeff Franzmann in this topic. 

High SciFi
--------
Hi Alvin, have you read Greg Bear's novels? Like Eon and Eternity? That's
the kind of SciFi I have dreamed about for a long time. Sorry, can't provide
TLs. Besides I had that kind of thing in mind when I asked about cyberspace.
If you make up something about that kind of society, let me know.

RC
--
Actually I think the whole RC is like EU. Lots of diversity. And political
balancing to do if administrators of the RC wants to succeed (or suck eggs).

Aubani are typical hero PCs found in every major FRPG. People from Oriflamme
are typical 'bad guys' or 'bad cops', still not necessarily your enemies. 
Others are much more interesting. 

Recovery
--------
I have also noticed that GDW has put much emphacy to post-holocaust recovery.
It is true that it can give you many good adventure possibilities, maybe even
greater number than stable society. It also gives you an excuse to use 
violence and bear arms (sorry about the last one).

Cities
------
You know, one thing that have allways amazed me in sci-fi rpgs is that about
all the cities are just like cities today. Maybe they are a bit bigger, but
I don't know any product that have put something *new* to cities. Something
that is not possible now. And I don't think grav cars are that something new.
Okay, there are (or were) grav cities, but I suppose they still looked like
"normal" cities except that they were on the sky.
BTW don't get offended, I also use modern cities as a model in my games.

AO
--
Have any of you made explorations to Alpha Crucis? I think that would be
quite natural direction (at least) from Aubaine.

Request
-------
Has anyone designed Hitech medical equipment?


Joni Virolainen
jonimv@evitech.fi


------------------------------

Date: 23 Sep 94 06:57:39 EDT
From: Hugh Foster <100326.446@compuserve.com>
To: "INTERNET:traveller@mpgn.com" <traveller@MPGN.COM>
Subject: TRAVELLER digest 46
Message-ID: <940923105738_100326.446_BHB60-3@CompuServe.COM>

>>does anyone have the frequencies of all the various star types? Or know
where I can look it up? <<

Isn't it in Book 6 (Scouts) ? Lemme look. Yep. Bolometric magnitude,
luminosity
and temperatures. Oh, hang on, do you mean "how often do they appear" ?
Anyway,
that's there too.


------------------------------

Date: 23 Sep 94 06:57:35 EDT
From: Hugh Foster <100326.446@compuserve.com>
To: "INTERNET:traveller@mpgn.com" <traveller@MPGN.COM>
Subject: TRAVELLER digest 47
Message-ID: <940923105735_100326.446_BHB60-1@CompuServe.COM>

>>  Yes, this is an Idea that I have used, and will use in the future.  
 Now that I have the DeLorme Street Atlas USA, I can even use the 
 detailed city map - just delete labels, and add my own... <<

Ah, memories.. my first PC adventure was set in the ref's own place of work
(a
chemical plant). He hated his job. He got a set of floorplans from the Admin
office, and we cheerfully blew crap out of the place. He loved it and so did
we.
(We tried to sneak in and plant bombs, but then somebody shot a nosey
security
guard with a silenced snub pistol, only to realize that it was loaded with
HEAP.. "Phut..............KABOOM!!" We laughed for hours at his face.). The
point is, the ref's familiarity with the play area made the surroundings come
alive. I've since used the same technique and it works wonders.


>> Has anyone else noticed that all of GDW's current run of role-
playing games is centered around societal recovery after a
holocaust? <<

Yes. _Yes._ YES! 

I object violently. I don't object _to_ Dark Future, or Post War gaming. But
I
object to having "our" system, Traveller, the domain of classic sci-fi and
military fiction, the realm of "the silver ships" (see Foundation etc)
hijacked
into the same mould. If I wanted to play after-the-war, I'd _play_ Twilight.
I
can. I've got it. But now, with all the "real" Traveller withdrawn, we can't
play anything _else_. Oh, sure, TNE is more generic - but where can you buy
background for non-NE settings ? 

This is my hobby horse you've stuck ginger into -  sorry. But I prefer to set
dangerous adventures against a stable background. It enhances the sensation
of
horror or fear. If everything's coming to bits, it's "ho hum, another world
falling to ruin". If Ripley had retruned to Earth and said "the aliens are
coming" and they'd responded "oh yeah, one was in here for a newspaper last
Tuesday", there wouldn't have been the frisson of horror that nobody believed
a
word she was saying.

I feel that betrayed by the loss of "real" Traveller that I've started
playing
AD&D again (as well, OK). It's amusing to note that the 2nd edition of that
(whatever your personal prefernces) is compatible with the first. You try
operating under MegaTraveller and using equipment and scenarios from TNE. It
doesn't work. I'm sorry, it _is_ a different game. 

Whoo, went a bit off the rails there. It's ok, doctor,  I feel better now. I
think I might get shouted at though...


------------------------------

Date: 23 Sep 94 06:57:41 EDT
From: Hugh Foster <100326.446@compuserve.com>
To: "INTERNET:traveller@mpgn.com" <traveller@MPGN.COM>
Subject: TRAVELLER digest 45
Message-ID: <940923105740_100326.446_BHB60-4@CompuServe.COM>

>> if the lawsuit is truly frivolous, the judge can and often will order the
PLAINTIFF  to pay the legal costs of the defendant <<

Doubtless true - _afterwards_. However, I think the original commentator was
thinking that you'd need the money up front to pay a lawyer to win the case
so
you can have your legal fees paid for not having to fight the case... <aargh!
disappears down plughole!>


------------------------------

Date: Fri, 23 Sep 94 10:29:06 EDT
From: CHiggin@aol.com
To: traveller@MPGN.COM
Subject: REAL high-tech societies.
Message-ID: <9409231029.tn157368@aol.com>

This is a science-fiction trivia quiz, right?  :-)

>     People have routine microchip implants in their head.  Depending on
>cost, they can update their chip info regularly.  This provides, say, the
>contents of the Encyclopedia Brittania.  More importantly, they can USE
>this information with ease. 

"Oath of Fealty", Niven & Pournelle.  Also, some stories from "High Justice"
by Jerry Pournelle.  Not to mention a lot of classic cyberpunk... 

Based on Real World developments, maybe TL 10.

>     All - even the lowest classes - are bioengineered for high intelligence
>(say, 180 IQ and above), have biosculptured bodies, and have a regular age
>span of 200 - 500 years.

"Sight of Proteus", Charles Sheffield.  See also "Ophiuchi Hotline", John
Varley.  Also Asimov's Spacer culture was like this -- see mention below.
 This is a dangerous practice in the long run, as your "designers" may well
toss out genes that seem undesirable to them, but that Evolution put in for a
very good reason.

TL 13+?

>     There have been "cheap" interstellar travel for a Very Long Time now. 
>Actually, thanks to Fusion/Cold Fusion power, AI, nanotech, star farming,
>biotech, Von Newmann machines, EVERYTHING has been cheap/free for
>centuries...
>except cutting edge military equipment, of course.

The "Star Wars" universe as depicted by George Lucas and detailed in Mayfair
Games' rulebooks.  The robotics/AI tech level in "Star Wars" is extremely
high -- almost eveything is handled by special purpose AIs.  The highly
specialized AI in your X-Wing talks to the more generalized supervisory AI in
your R2 droid, for example... Space Travel is at least 30,000 years old in
the Star Wars galaxy, and is a cheap, commonplace technology -- like the
internal combustion engine is now, only it is as old to the Star Wars galaxy
as the wheel is to us... Laser weaponry ("blasters") is so ancient and
accepted a technology that animal-riding barbarians who think a starship's
power core is a magical artifact use home-built blasters as a matter of
course... In "Star Wars", hi-tech is everyday, dusty, battered, rust-flecked
equipment that is considered just... equipment, or tools -- not the chromed,
white-painted and spotless "gee-whiz neato keeno" hi-tech stuff you see in
Star Trek or Buck Rogers, or Battlestar Galactica...

The big breakthru is unlimited cheap energy from fusion (or any other source)
at TL9.  The 3rd Imperium SHOULD look like this, as the Vilani introduced the
underlying technologies 10,000 years ago.

>     While sex is as free as in the late 20th Century West, reproduction
>is a carefully regulated activity, one of the two powers that the State
>controls (the other being the military).  All children are designed, not
>just 'sired' or 'begotten'.

Earth in Larry Niven's Known Space stories.  See the "Gil the ARM" stories,
the "Beowulf Shaeffer" stories, and others.  Overcrowded Earth government
(the U.N.) permits only one child per person -- and you can be denied a
reproductive license if your genes are undesirable.  People with highly
desired genes, like geniuses, are issued reproductive licenses for unlimited
reproduction.  Later, the Birthright Lotteries were introduced, where a
limited number of reproductive licenses were issued based on random draw.
 This eventually turned out to be a puppeteer scheme to breed a "lucky" human
being -- read "Ringworld" and "Ringworld Engineers".

This is possible as soon as you have reliable birth control (around TL6), or
at TL0 with retroactive birth control.  It is an attitude, (totalitarian),
not a technology.

>     Most live in perfectly controlled enviroments: many perfer to live in a
>Virtual enviroment, and can live out their lives with only a few forays
>into The Real World (tm).

This is recurring theme in scifi -- I vaguely remember a short story in one
of the "Best of Analog" collections  about a society where you lived in a
"cocoon" in a sealed city all your life -- you worked via remote-link, food
and health services were delivered automatically, robots or remote-control
drones did all the physical work and maintenance, etc.  The city is
eventually cut off from the rest of the world when the glaciers of the next
Ice Age roll over it, and no one in the city notices... except the guy who
maintains the weather station outside.

Asimov's "Caves of Steel" stories depict people who live in sealed cities and
are pathologically afraid to venture outside.  Also, some of his robot
stories depict societies where everythings is cheap and humans have every
whim served by robots, with only a few forays into the Real World.  These
societies are also dying out...

In one of Alan Dean Foster's books ("Prism"), the hero was from a planet
where everyone wore life-support suits all the time, that took care of all
their needs (sustenance, waste disposal, medical, etc.) and never exposed
 bare skin to the world.  Foster didn't mention what they did for sex...

TL 9 or 10 -- a California Pizza Hut already takes orders via Internet for
delivery to your computer... 

>     For REAL computing/communication power, all have a PDA - personal
>digital assisstant - which handles heavy data transfers and continous
>contact with the WorldNet.  The PDA also intelligence - say, that of a
>teenager.

Minus the AI, TL 8.  It's starting to happen now.  The clues are the
increasing functionality being added to pagers (they used to just beep, now
they download your e-mail for you), the marriage of high-end laptops to
cellular phones, the increasing availability of access to the Internet and
other Wide-area networks/services, the impending marriages between cable
companies and on-line services, and magic words like "Iridium" and "McCaw
Cellular".

                                       -- Cynthia



------------------------------

Date: Fri, 23 Sep 94 11:27:01 EDT
From: CHiggin@aol.com
To: traveller@MPGN.COM
Subject: GDW's games
Message-ID: <9409231127.tn160918@aol.com>



From: 556N@delphi.com (Dave Reed)

*   On GDW:
*
*   I cannot resist asking y'all (yes, that's proper English in
*   Texas):
*
*   Has anyone else noticed that all of GDW's current run of
*   role- playing games is centered around societal recovery
*   after a holocaust?
*
*   I did:  1) Cadillacs and Dinosaurs
*           2) Twilight:  2000
*           3) Merc:  2000
*           4) Dark Conspiracy
*           5) Traveller:  The New Era
*
*   If I didn't miss any, they're all post-catastrophe...
*   Interesting.
*
*   Mr.  Wiseman, oh ye grand Prophet of Doom, why, praytell, is
*   this?  I've admired you're handiwork in Twilight:  2000 for
*   years.  I enjoyed the first edition, and each one after...
*   But why ALL of GDW's games?

    Having watched all these games come out, I think that GDW has
    20-20 hindsight rather than any prophetic ability.  GDW has a
    problem with not enough staff to develop games speedily, and
    tend to come out "a day late and a dollar short" when they
    develop games to cash in on a trend.  First, _Twilight:2000_
    -- looks like they tried to do a mellower version of FGU's
    _Aftermath_ and cash in on the "survivalist" fad of the early
    80s.  They missed the boat.

    Second, _Cadillacs_and_Dinosaurs_ -- this is the "Lookee, we
    got a licensed property!"  one.  I think it was originally
    brought out to catch the "role-playing games based on faddish
    alternative comicbooks" trend.  The _Judge_Dredd_ rpg (by
    whoever) and Palladium's _TMNT_ rpg are other examples of
    this trend.  They would've missed the boat on this one, but
    they had the 1st edition in a drawer somewhere when "Jurassic
    Park" came out, so they rushed out a 2nd edition printing.
    (Note that until Jurassic Park, C&D was as dead as 2300AD or
    Space:1889.  And, anybody seen any new supplements for it?)

    Third, _Merc:2000_ -- this was an attempt to update and
    modify the background of _Twilight:2000_ for potential buyers
    who found the World War III scenario increasingly implausible
    given current world events.  I personally find T2k MORE
    plausible now than before the collapse of the Soviet Union,
    but you know what opinions are like.

    Fourth, _Dark_Conspiracy_ -- someone finally noted that "Dark
    Future" games were popular, and that Chaosium was coining
    money with _Call_of_Cthulhu_ and attempted to kill two birds
    with one stone.  Not only did they miss the boat with this
    one, but they combined the worst features of the two genres,
    not the best (IMHO).

    Fifth, TNE -- another stab at a "Dark Future" rpg.  They
    missed the boat with Hard Times MegaT, and missed the 2nd
    boat with TNE; i.e., by the time they got it out, "Dark
    Future" games were long gone from the scene.  They've been
    replaced by fantasy, space opera, and out-and-out horror --
    all escapist themes.

    Here's the clue -- people read books and play RPGs to enjoy
    themselves.  When times are good, gritty, "dark future",
    "film noir" stuff is moderately popular.  When the economy
    goes in the dumpster, and people are shooting each other
    outside your apartment door, the LAST thing you want to play
    is a game that looks like Real Life.  You want to "escape"
    your grim Real World -- hence the popularity of escapist
    themes.  It happened in the Great Depression -- that's when
    Science Fiction, Horror and Fantasy took off as literary
    genres; all three made a big comeback during the
    recession-plagued 70s, and all three are popular game themes
    now.

    I predicted (just ask Steve or the couple that runs our local
    game store), back when the 1990 recession started to bite
    hard, and again when Clinton was elected, that the "Dark
    Future" genre was dead on its feet and would soon fade from
    popularity.  Look around; the successful games are Fantasy
    (AD&D, GURPS etc, Shadowrun, Earthdawn), Horror (Vampire et
    al., Call of Cthulhu, lots of new games), or space
    opera/optimistic scifi (Star Wars RPG, GURPS etc).  Somebody
    ought to kick Avalon Hill and tell them them to push
    RuneQuest, as it should do well now.  And TSR didn't sue GDW
    over _Dangerous_Journeys_ because they thought it would fade
    with a whimper and take GDW down with it (like some here
    thought).

    Miscellaneous notes:  I do not like to play T2K because the
    Real World looks too much like it (Sarajevo, anyone?).  GDW's
    best work, IMHO, has been in games that weren't trying to
    follow a trend:  Classic Traveller, Space:1889, 2300AD.  A
    pity none of those games or backgrounds are supported
    anymore...  I still think the TNE ruleset married to the
    Classic Traveller background would have made a heckuva game.


                        -- Cynthia

------------------------------

End of TRAVELLER Digest 49
**************************
